All Things Microsoft > Microsoft Software
Windows Never Changes!!!
hm_murdock:
Sorry,
Did you say something?
Orethrius:
I'm going to step out of line here and apologize for WMD calling you an idiot, that was not called for. Unfortunately, most of the rest of what he posted was accurate. You're not winning ANYBODY over by implying that rebels that happen to dual-boot or not want to lose all their precious downloaded files are Billy boy's henchmen.
Here's the way I see it: there are Windows zealots, Linux zealots, and fence-sitters. I myself was a fence-sitter until one year ago. It was at that time that I started to realize that there was life beyond Windows. What did I do? I wasn't quite sure about this "Linux thing" quite yet, so I decided to try some OSS flavours of FTP and HTTP servers for Windows. You know the like, FileZilla and Apache and all those. These were so infinitely better than anything Microsoft had EVER offered that I started getting into the "alternative browser" market.
Then I discovered Firefox. It absolutely blows MSIE out of the water, but Windows has a little problem. It seems the two are inextricably linked together... no problem, some nice gents at Microsuck helped me find a program called XPLite. My primary problem with XP was that it had so little choice. With that program, I removed file protection and yanked MSIE. While I was at it, I supplanted Thunderbird where Outlook once stood.
After all this, I started to notice how much XP was starting to look like Linux, except for that damnable registry. So what did I do? One month ago today, I started to boot into Redhat on an almost-religious basis. Recently, some of the members here helped me discover the Linux-NTFS project, with which I managed to finally get Redhat to read all the files I had stored on the XP partition! As a result, I am now proudly booting into Linux on a daily basis. What is XP to me now? A file manager, which it always has been, little more. A prettied-up, bloated interface to BitTorrent until I can get the Linux client to work properly. Once Linux-NTFS supports stable writes to NTFS partitions, I'm going to dump XP altogether.
The point of the story is that not everybody transitions in a heartbeat. In fact, I doubt that even YOU, kind sir, were convinced that Linux was "all that" the first time you "kicked the tires." The point is that you need to meet the fence-sitters halfway. If you start waving the Linux flag too soon, bragging about "I can do THIS with a shell script, you bloody Windows fanboy" too soon, you WILL lose them.
In the fight against Microsoft, we need every person we can get - and if that means that we use Windows against its manufacturer for a time by using alternative products on it, what one might call guerilla warfare of sorts, then so be it. We'll kick their asses on their terms, our terms, and the terms of everybody in between. Until then, we need to convince people that OSS is NOT the Satanic force that M$ makes it out to be. Brash elitism will never accomplish that.
hm_murdock:
I think it's equally important not to act like MS is evil too. That sure as Hell doesn't help. A lot of people don't see a problem with them, and they'll see it as "silly", "childish", "immature", and to some of them its "jealousy".
Stop being such a child about it, BASHman. Grow up and live in the world that exists if I know somebody who wants to run Linux, I sit down with them and we discuss what they really want and need to do. Many times, we decide that Windows is better for them, and then I help them learn to make it run well.
It's not hard, it only takes some work... just like it takes some work for most people to make Linux run at all.
Linux is not perfect for everybody, just like Windows isn't.
You lose, BASHman.
WMD:
quote:WMD,
Calling me an idiot won't change the fact that you've been on this site for almost a year, that you're a site moderator, and yet you still use Windows. That's what I just don't understand.
--- End quote ---
I apologize for myself, now. And, I have an explanation for my use of Windows. I don't really want to; I have Slackware 10 installed and it's my preferred environment. It's the internet. Most of what I do with my computers involve the internet, and since Linux came to exist via the communication provided by it, access is that much more important.
However, I don't have access in Linux, because Linksys didn't write drivers for the wireless USB card I have. I've tried two sets of drivers for different chipsets, with no luck. Therefore I'm stuck in Windows World. I have a plan to buy a wireless-to-ethernet bridge device, and use my supported-in-Linux ethernet card.
Problem is, those aren't cheap, and I'm a 16-year-old without a steady income. I could probably afford it, barely, but I have other things I want to buy, as well. I can't decide yet.
That's why I still use Windows. I hope this is enough for you to understand.
dishawjp:
quote:
even YOU, kind sir, were convinced that Linux was "all that" the first time you "kicked the tires." The point is that you need to meet the fence-sitters halfway. If you start waving the Linux flag too soon, bragging about "I can do THIS with a shell script, you bloody Windows fanboy" too soon, you WILL lose them.
--- End quote ---
Midnight Candidate,
I agree with all that you posted about transitioning to OSS for those people first considering the move from MSWindows. I also agree that bludgeoning people over the head for using MSWindows when they are not aware or only beginning to become aware of the alternatives is counterproductive. My remarks were directed ONLY to those who were obviously aware of and well versed in OSS, AND who were members of MES (formerly FuckMicrosoft.com) AND who were still using MSWindows.
What I was trying to say was that if even those people still felt that they had to use MSWindows, then maybe there was something wrong. I wanted, but evidently failed, to to make clear the distinction between people who were new to Linux and OSS alternatives to MS products and those who were knowledgeable and had a good grasp of Linux and who professed a hatred of Microsoft, but who still used MSWindows.
I fully understand that there is a learning curve to Linux and that nobody can, will, or should just dump their data and OS and switch overnight. My remarks, were directed to people who, in my opinion, should have the skills to have converted entirely and yet were still using and learning the latest versions of MSWindows.
quote:
I think it's equally important not to act like MS is evil too. That sure as Hell doesn't help. A lot of people don't see a problem with them, and they'll see it as "silly", "childish", "immature", and to some of them its "jealousy".
--- End quote ---
JimmyJames,
My remarks weren't directed to those people, they were directed towards members of this forum. Long term members at that, who were still using Windows. If you recall my first post in this thread, I specifically said that I understood the original poster's POV perfectly. My remarks weren't directed to Microsoft lovers who would have seen them as "childish" or "silly," at least not intentionally. I thought that I was posting to MicroSuck. I only was surprised/saddened to see that professed Microsoft haters with a good working knowledge of Linux, were still using MSWindows. I was trying to understand why that was, and also implied that if that were the case, maybe Microsoft would win and the "Linux Revolution" was a lost cause.
This is not a direct criticism of people who use both systems, but I find it upsetting that those who have the ability to switch and who claim to hate everything that Microsoft stands for, still use MS products.
Is that clear?
quote:
However, I don't have access in Linux, because Linksys didn't write drivers for the wireless USB card I have. I've tried two sets of drivers for different chipsets, with no luck. Therefore I'm stuck in Windows World. I have a plan to buy a wireless-to-ethernet bridge device, and use my supported-in-Linux ethernet card.
--- End quote ---
WMD,
My turn to apologize. That is a perfectly rational reason for using MSWindows. I withdraw any criticism I may have made of your use of both OS's. I hope that you can get set up soon with internet access on Linux. You'll love it.
Everyone,
I guess I started a bigger shitstorm here than I had intended. What I was trying to point out is my disappointment if people who apparently had the knowledge, equipment and ability to switch from Microsoft to a good alternative AND who were members of a forum whose name was FuckMicrosoft.com still used MSWindows, then Linux, the BSD's and OSX were never likely to become mainstream OS's. That was my whole point. No criticism of newbies transitioning to OSS, no criticism of people still learning and weaning themselves off Microsoft, no criticism of people still getting their hardware together or anything like that was intended.
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