Miscellaneous > The Lounge
Firearms debate (formerly Symantec Firewall blocks freedom)
TheQuirk:
Okay, I will solve this for all of you:
You should own firearms because they are cool.
You know I'm right! :rolleyes: :D ;) :cool:
hm_murdock:
quote:Just because it's a law doesn't make it right
--- End quote ---
it's not a law, dude. it's one of the cornerstones of our nation. it's one of the ORIGINAL FREEDOMS promised in the Bill of Rights, which is part of The Constitution of the United States of America.
Perhaps you might want to read it?
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.billofrights.html
Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, [bold]the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.[/bold]
The amendment exists for several reasons...
1) To protect the people from the government. YES. YOU HEARD RIGHT... TO PROTECT THE PEOPLE FROM THE GOVERNMENT. The People of the United States hold the power, but they've let it lapse. It's no longer from the people to the leaders, but it has now become from the leaders to the people.
2) To protect the nation. Not everybody is in the military service. Those who are not can still fight if the battle comes to their homes, into their town, their city. If the United States were invaded, however improbable, if enemy troops set foot on our soil, there would be ordinary citizens dropping the fuckers as quickly as the US Military would be.
3) To protect the citizens from each other. Crime is a problem, there's no getting around it. We should have the right to defend ourselves against it. If someone breaks into your home, your place of living, where you, and your family reside, you were promised the right to dispose of him. It's only in today's immoral, shit-driven, money-powered social wasteland that a criminal or his family can take you to court. However, the instances of people winning cases like that are rare. A judge and jury will very seldom find in favor of the criminal. If someone breaks into a person's home and is killed... that is the way it should be.
Now, I've been cordial, and have given you foreigners the benefit of the doubt, but you seem pretty dead set that somehow you're more right than I am, that somehow, because I feel strongly about a matter, that I'm some kind of "fanatic"... no, I just actually believe in something.
Aww, does that douse your preconceptions of Americans as being dull, mindless people who follow everything unquestioningly? If so, GOOD. If not, then fuck off. Maybe if you knew anything about the fucking world, you'd know that we're all the goddamn fucking same. We're all humans.
But people who put down others simply because they believe in something sicken me. The mediocrity I see in these posts is appalling. I understand that where you're from is different. THAT'S NOT THE ISSUE, IS IT, BUDDY?
No. The issue exists here. I believe in something. If you don't agree with it, that's fine. You don't have to. If you feel that you believe so strongly against it, then get up off your worthless, lazy ass, come to the United States and speak your mind to the Congress.
Now shut up with your whining, because that's all it is.
"Oh no, guns kill people. Boo hoo. I live in a country where there's no guns, and I'm going to belittle you for living in a country where they are... I'm going to insult you for standing up for something you believe in. I'm a whiney, crying, mediocre nancy boy who's too pussy to believe in jack."
If you don't agree, that's fine. That's your fucking choice to make, not mine. I'm not forcing a choice on you, don't fucking force one on me. I don't flame you for being a "fucking pussy ass peacenik" now do I? I don't respect you any less because you're anti gun, or because the nation you live in has limits on firearms. It doesn't affect you as a person.
Stop acting like a bunch of fucking babies. This isn't your country, so stop worrying and whining about it.
billy_gates:
Bravo Jimmy. I have nothing to add to that. That is exactly my opinion.
Oh and Flap you took my quote way out of context. Right after I said that I said it would work in theory, but not in reality.
flap:
quote:Now shut up with your whining, because that's all it is.
--- End quote ---
Who's whining? You're the one who's putting your view across in angry, overly-defensive posts. We don't really have any reason to whine or complain. We can be quite smug about the fact that we already live in a country where guns aren't legal.
quote: If you don't agree, that's fine. That's your fucking choice to make, not mine. I'm not forcing a choice on you, don't fucking force one on me. I don't flame you for being a "fucking pussy ass peacenik" now do I? I don't respect you any less because you're anti gun, or because the nation you live in has limits on firearms. It doesn't affect you as a person.
--- End quote ---
What are you talking about? No-one is attacking anyone personally. Who, besides you, has insulted anyone else in this thread? There isn't a single flame here.
Faust:
quote:it's not a law, dude. it's one of the cornerstones of our nation. it's one of the ORIGINAL FREEDOMS promised in the Bill of Rights, which is part of The Constitution of the United States of America.
--- End quote ---
Oh so its written on a MORE IMPORTANT bit of paper? Completely changes the situation then... Words arent important, beliefs are. If the belief of the American people changes tomorrow, so should the constitution. Sorry, but I hope that a democratic person like you wouldnt want a piece of paper signed by a lot of dead people to be more important than democratic process... So in the mean time we can argue for beliefs and you can't try and justify them with a symbol OK?
Wasnt this the same constitution that was amended to prohibit "intoxicating liquors!" DEAR GOD! The constitution says you cant booze! Must obey, it was in the constitution and surely you cant argue with the constitution right? Stop reading from a useless description of the law only when it profits you please.
Oh and arms? Arms means weapons and you are saying that this amendment lets you own any weapon you want without restrictions from the government.
Should you have the right to own nuclear weapons or do you believe in restrictions? Restrictions, not complete loss, is all I think would help.
quote:There are different home defense situations, a gun may or may not help. Why does burglary still happen? This is because many people in the US do not own a gun, due to anti-gun messages and anti-gun laws in many states
--- End quote ---
Do you have any evidence for this?
quote:I look at guns as details, not the big picture. Guns can create alot of new issues(like that maryland sniper incident, or columbine), but in the overall day to day murders and injuries, would they really have a major effect? If 4 thugs have guns and attack you, you are fucked. If 4 thugs have baseball bats and attack you, you are still fucked(some people might not be, but most would). In the vast majority of cases, the victim would be dead or hospitalized. How would gun control help here?
--- End quote ---
A gun can kill someone a lot quicker than a baseball bat can. At least with baseball bats you can run, and there is more chance of a trained medic being able to save you. The columbine murderers used Tec-9 semiautomatic pistols. Dude they look more like mac-10s than pistols... There is NO NEED for you to have access to that gun. Its not useful for hunting and unless your being burgled by what, 20 or so guys you dont need something that powerful to defend yourself. If the columbine murderers didnt have access to guns as powerful as that then a lot less people would have died.
quote:You should own firearms because they are cool.
--- End quote ---
This and the comment earlier about owning a desert eagle "because its cool." How responsible of you all.
quote:If someone breaks into a person's home and is killed... that is the way it should be.
--- End quote ---
Again you are making it seem like you believe money is more important than life.
quote:But people who put down others simply because they believe in something sicken me. The mediocrity I see in these posts is appalling. I understand that where you're from is different. THAT'S NOT THE ISSUE, IS IT, BUDDY?
--- End quote ---
I'm not putting you down, I'm arguing for my beliefs. Sorry, but thats one of the freedoms I do believe in. If you cant take it then dont listen.
quote:"Oh no, guns kill people. Boo hoo. I live in a country where there's no guns, and I'm going to belittle you for living in a country where they are... I'm going to insult you for standing up for something you believe in. I'm a whiney, crying, mediocre nancy boy who's too pussy to believe in jack."
--- End quote ---
I believe in a lot of things. One of those things is that your gun laws are too loose. If you dont like my beliefs, if you cant take me exercising my freedom of speech then you dont have to listen. Or you can argue back, we both have the right to free speech. But you're not going to solve anything with weak insults.
quote:Stop acting like a bunch of fucking babies. This isn't your country, so stop worrying and whining about it.
--- End quote ---
Iraq isnt your country either, but a lot of you worried about that. China isnt my country either, but me and my Taiwanese friend worry about them. You live in a global community, and you cant just say that outsiders dont have a right to criticize your corner of it. Did outsiders have a right to criticize germanies treatment of jews?
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