Stop Microsoft
All Things Microsoft => Microsoft as a Company => Topic started by: beltorak0 on 21 August 2002, 06:37
-
< DIV CLASS="SuspendFlamesAndThink">
read the following two articles;
let me know what you think...
-t.
Damn the Constitution: Europe must take back the Web (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/26612.html)
Bill Thompson answers critics (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/26695.html)
-
Well im happy that i can still buy a tcpa and palladium free computer. I will never buy one.
-
I think that man is a crack-pot. If Europeans don't want to be bound by American politics, then using what is referred to by him as "trusted computers" would be very very counterproductive. Laws passed in USA such as DCMA seeping out and into other countrys could end up being a very big problem indeed, but I think a more carefully thought out solution than using Fritz chips or whatever to zone off the internet is necessary. There are better, more efficient, and less restricting ways to get the job done. What Bill Thompson suggests would only take control of the Internet out of one opressor's hands and put it into another's.
V
-
Ah yes, take back the web article. Dammit, that Bill Thompson guy just screams "I SUCK!". (http://smile.gif)
Seems very arrogant.
I like the internet being low on regulation, it should be a vortex. US values? Ummm not much difference. First world country is first world country.
He does have a good point with saying he doesn't like DMCA or censor software. However, when your in another country, do you have to listen to what some cry baby American(no offense) wants? They can't legally do shit... unless you do some major hacking and they cry to your government about it.
US shoulden't make the laws... NO ONE should be able to make the laws.
He disses William Gibson(well not majorily), he disses the US constitution, he disses the founding fathers(todays American politicians are alot less admirable), and he disses the US. Now I diss him. ;)
-
ALRIGHT VOIDMAIN AND CALUM IT HAS BEEN A LONG TIME AND I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR YOU TO PICK THIS TO PIECES on the 29-letter word level
but now i am going to attempt to do this verbal acrobatic feat myself, only i am gonna do it on redneck level (see next post) (also i am drunk) (no nets here).... here it comes....
-
quote:
Originally posted by beltorak0:
[QB]< DIV CLASS="SuspendFlamesAndThink">
read the following two articles;
let me know what you think...
-t.
good post man, shit... thanks for diggin this one up.
snippets and pissnets:
quote:
Unless we can take back the Net from the libertarians, constitutional lawyers and rapacious corporations currently recreating the worst excesses of US political and commercial culture online, we will end up with an Internet which serves the imperial ambitions of only one country instead of the legitimate aspirations of the whole world.
would this include australian aboriginies? i'm pretty sure they dont like "crocadile dundee" or any of the discovery channel's electronic soul-stealers, but it sure fucking defends thier land by proxy. i dont want the enron-ites planting strip mines in the heart of africa either, but attacking (stupid) imperialists suggests that the big-time developers can do anything they want without any regulation... ever heard of montana? ever heard the FACT that northern america is less industrially developed than africa (afrique)? ever wonder why? the EPA of the US stops US companies from laying waste to this (awful) place, so they go over there (NOT regulated) and use, to thier own advantage, the (lacking) rules of the very (COMMY) places in which you are trying to defend freedom of development independent of the US. leave the cyber-community and join the real world if you want "the people" to benefit.
quote:
It is time to reclaim the net from the Americans.
there have been some big fucking scandals lately. it even looks to me, with all the big ass benefits these CEO's have been getting JUST BEFORE the company collapses like a flan in a cupboard (eddy izzard fror you lib. euros) are there to benefit fall guys in a deal to fake the money necessary to fund CONSTRUCTING an actual INTERnet, where everyone is ACTUALLY ABLE TO BE WELCOME. if the euros developed an internet nobody would understand a word of it, it would be all separated by the facists, and there would be no fuckmicrosoft.... nor would m$ be so all-powerful.... come to f00in think of it... thanks to the english speakers (world wide voted number one language!), and the 'merricans, there has now developed an internet where my grandma can open an email from her german cousin and have it INSTANTLY translated into english--for the cost of winders and internet. i have seen the AOL commercials that make it look like there are several internets, and your friends are all strictly on the AOL internet (even JUNO expolits this). imagine if every time you connected this was TRUE, and only the 15 people on your proposed euro-net could talk to you.... it would be more fun to play minesweeper and doom. (hell sometimes it is more fun)
quote:
The first is the idea that the Internet is somehow outside or above the real world and its national boundaries. If I phone someone in Nigeria and suggest a money-laundering fraud then it is obvious to all that I am breaking the law in two countries, not in 'phonespace'. Nobody has ever suggested that the content of the telephone network -all those voice calls -should be somehow privileged and treated as outside the normal world.
if you call nigeria, and propose phone-sex, no one in america gives a damn (except tipper gore) until you try to fuck a 12-year-old, then watch out for the cia, fbi, or nsa... of maybe the NFW (nuclear fucking weapons) of course we would rather catch all your takers and lock them in a dungeon til kingdom fucking come, and let you go on til we feel like killing ya (looks like suicide)
we dont give a shit... it is not your business once you cross the MORAL line. there is no law higher than common sense. no bible, no koran, no fat fucking buddah. ALL SIMPLE COMMON SENSE. the united states prosecutes mass-murders, people that fly planes into buildings --you best bet that if this happenned in the UK or france or wherever you are we would bomb these "poor people" even futher into the stone age--, facists, stupid people, and even the poor ol beat up commies, then march in and set up a friendly government and give them a billion billion US DOLLARS and a trade agreement with the peaceful world (WHY THE FUCK DO SOME EURO-FUCKS SUPPORT PALESTINIAN SUICIDE BOMBERS???) and mail drop a hundred thousand computers and a bllion tons of US beef and corn and a bunch of chinese rice and a hundered thousand metric tons of franch crouque-monsieurs in american made saran-wrap labeled "fuck you, eat developed world food or piss off"
AHHHHHH!
okay...
quote:
Why, then, do we act as if our interactions with screen, mouse and keyboard are different? If I send an email suggesting that I am in possession of $50m and will hand it over in return for your bank details, why can't it just be that I also am breaking the law in two countries, not in some mythical 'cyberspace' with its own legal system?
are you morally straight?
so you propose that microsoft's TCPA go ahead, and maybe we can revive LENIN and put him an charge. what strides have been made elsewhere? ones that dont lock out TRULY FREE fuckers, like me (saying what i want and telling the fbi to piss off), and also preserving the feelings of the lesbian chimpanzee preservation barber-shop singers organization have NOT been taken, simply because the FOUNDING FATHERs
quote:
Each country should decide for itself.
okay, so roll back the clock 500 years
quote:
This would not stop the US treating its Constitution as the only true source of wisdom[....]
not the only source, but the UK sure fucking followed suit. we are sure (currntly) fucking successful, and you all would be fucked had not ACTUAL PEOPLE (not cyber people) DEFENDED YOUR GRANDPARENTS' ASSES IN WORLD WAR 2! MY GRANDFATERS BOTH KICKED THE ANUS OUT OF YOUR GRANDPARENTS POTENTIAL MURDERERS, AND ~NOW~ ===WE=== ARE THE SAID 'OPRESSORS' ?
enuff caps
go to the concentration camp, or piss off and shut rhe hell up.
quote:
equivalent of the arrival of the black helicopters from the UN World Government Army.
there to extract you from the midst of a million rioting somalis
quote:
-and I believe that Europe is the place for it to start.
just like nazi germany
quote:
Europe is the birthplace of the Web, with a wealthy, technically literate population, a network infrastructure that rivals that of the US and a rich cultural and political tradition which can counter US constitutional imperialism.
diddn't ya hear? al gore invented the internet!
ever notice he diddnt get elected
fuck it, off subject, al gore did not ride hi presidental campaing on "the economy" becuse they had been lying all along (in case you had not niticed). honestly, the last demo- administration infladed "the economy" by as much t 30%, and the said "bush recession" had already ended and was rebounding a couple of months (after the election) before the innaguiration. hell, a democratic voter is (roughly, by my guestimations based in actual fact) three times more likely to be a murderer.
(based on this: murder rate for gore counties +13% vs. bush's counties = 3%. figure 1/10 murders unsolved. call it roughly 9% balancing both ways: innocent accusations, unaccused guilties, and wrongful minority accusations..) if you are a gore voter you are a liberitarian, demo, and have much better chance of being offended by me.... hey, gore voters and somewhat more likely class a felons... lick my constricted conservative anus! you are exactly what this guy and i (with a capital 'i') hate! the people's replblic of california can be invaded by the people's suppressions of china and i halfway doubt the US government would notice the VX gas.
the US has no imperialists, just a bunch of assholes trying to make frinds to "borrow" money from. NO WORKING HUNGRY HERE ASSHOLE!
quote:
those who abused the information provided to them by individuals would be prosecuted.
and will be prosecuted
quote:
how many Founding Fathers can stand on the head of a pin.
EXCELLENT WORDING, WONDERFUL POINT
quote:
It cannot be allowed to succeed, and so those of us within Europe need to begin to work now to extend our culture onto the Net in all its complex glory. We need to build our borders online and offer our citizens protection within those borders, and escape from America. It cannot be allowed to succeed, and so those of us within Europe need to begin to work now to extend our culture onto the Net in all its complex glory. We need to build our borders online and offer our citizens protection within those borders, and escape from America.
HAHAHAHAHHA YOU CANNOT ESCAPE MUAHAAHAHAH!!! HA! HA! HAHAHAH! HA ! Ha hahah! ha. hahaha. SHUT THE FUCK UP ASSHOLE
ever heard the term ISOLATIONSIST?
if your citizens commit a crime, and it is immoral, FUCK IT, we will arrest them and do whatever the jury says to do
look. i see what he means... thats great... but he is *MOSTLY* wrong
americans are dirty fucking pricks sometimes.
i am an asshole
so do something about it. create an isolationst euro-net. we will just invade iraq all the same and you will offer (unneeded) help all the same.
this guy is smarter than me. if i have made a gross misjudgement here, well i guess it's my redneck loudmouth anus taking over. but so matter how much any liberitarian posing as a conservative house pet wants to talk smack, the important fact is that an INTERNATIONAL MORAL DE-FACTO RULE be upheld without question, not one that relies on a worthless minimalist rebelious prick rallying a pack of zombie lesbos that determine what is "okay."
i respect the right of this guy t5o say what he wants, but he does not respect my right to reply... he would rather bash my coutry.
tony blair fucking rules!!!!! the facist prick cunting whore of a candidate lost the french election! taqke your smirnoff ice and piss off to the fiberglass shithouse!
i very eagerly await my being shot down my intellectual superiors, interperet this shite and tell me what i missed, so i cam keep my fucking mouth shut
OH and by the way, MS releasing its (selected) source code has yet to benefit these types... show me the funny
YOU PEOPLE GASSED THE PUPPY DOG ON CNN, AND YOU KILLED JESUS!!!
[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: sporkme / bob ]
-
check this out:
we will invade iraq, then iran. we will sponser anti-terror in pseudo-isreal. we will dislodge arafat. we may be forced to KILL TERRORIST POPULAR FUCKTARDS LIKE REDRANGERSOFTWARE
*ACCIDENTALLY oops
the people that are now populating guantanamo bay will go home to find a brick house and taxed planatation or a job in a kia factory and boatloads of industialist (imperialist) fucktard probaganda-laden FOOD and MONEY and a fat horny wife to fuck and all
piss off you bastards, we are right, right or wrong hahahahhahahahaha
[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: sporkme / bob ]
-
quote:
It is time to reclaim the net from the Americans.
I think it would me more useful to reclaim the net from the corporations.
Also why dont you americans use your best card ( the constitution) to try and fight all this TCPA crap. I'm sure it is unconstitutional somehow?
-
heheh, that was half me talking, and half was a fifth of vodka
this guy wants to take the net from the "liberitarian americans" but he would just be handing it right on over to the euro liberitarians instead. he is a little ~al gore~ over there, and i hope and pray he is in the minority
also, allow me to reiterate: everyone is free to use the internet, including scuzzy filthy big ugly 'merrikan corporations. neo nazis over there can even post shit about killing israel and rounding up all the arabs, and not going into iraq, and not fighting the backwards terrorists that have sand in thier clits over us being able to feed ourselves AND them (the envious fundamentalist trogladites).
------------------
at any rate, tux, the constitution has been dragged through the mud to defend some STUPID crap, and really has begun to lose some of it's all-powerful standpoint and rightous luster.
the afforementioned founding fathers were a bunch of slave owning farmers, and never could have imagined that they would be laying the tracks for an information superhighway. or a bunch of thieves in washington.
more importantly, the morons in charge of our government can scarcely check thier own email, let alone understand the function of a fritz chip or the difference between open and hidden source.
this isolationist, facist, communist argument for a euro-net, like some lofty golf club, is as preposterous as it is fundamentally wrong.
i don't like the net being a giant digitized commercial anymore than he does. ad banners, cookies, spam... all of it makes me want to puke. it has nothing to do with americans alone, nor does it represent any kind of conspiracy to suck in a bunch of europeans. it is an open forum, and this idiots innane allegiance to the liberitarian total control of the internet may stamp out ads, but soon the karma police will get him when he can't vent his opinions like i am now.
the tcpa is unconstitutional, if a three year old does the interpretation. his moral compass is true north, and the slimeball legal experts haven't wiped thier asses on his face yet. the problem is that it may as well be written in aramaic, because the US constitution has more loopholes, ammendments, and unclear sections than the fucking bible. it's so bad that i can also make it look like it was DESIGNED to SUPPORT palladium.
i know it is wrong. they know it is wrong. we all know it is wrong. when CNN aired the video of the puppy being gassed, they knew it was wrong. when the executives at enron and worldcom started siphoning off billions of dollars and lying about it, they knew it was wrong.
they just don't fucking care... they just want to turn a buck or two trillion.
well we DO care, and it is up to use to stop fucktards like this guy from stealing our common human rights.
if this slughead were to succeed in chopping off the lines that connect him to his counterparts across the atlantic, it would be the single most restrictive action ever taken in flow of information. it would guarentee microsoft unchallenged rule over him and the zombies who agree with his big, stinky, loud opinion.
this really friggin bothers me
and i am right :D
[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: sporkme / bob ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by sporkme / bob:
heheh, that was half me talking, and half was a fifth of vodka
Uh that would only add up to seven tenths. (http://smile.gif)
-
a fifth of vodka?
would that mean that you drank only 20% of the ingredients that make vodka?
-
A fifth of a bottle maybe?
I agree that we need to reclaim the net from the corporations. Europe can have the net, I just want decent cell-phone service & coverage like they have!
-
a fifth is a size of bottles of liquor
750ml
[ August 23, 2002: Message edited by: sporkme / bob ]
-
No, 750ml is three quarters of a liter (litre).
-
its 75 ten thousandths of a hectalitre
i could really go for a .00075 Hl bottle of vodka right now
[ August 23, 2002: Message edited by: Master of Reality / Bob ]
[ August 23, 2002: Message edited by: Master of Reality / Bob ]
[ August 23, 2002: Message edited by: Master of Reality / Bob ]
-
Wow, yep you are a redneck Spork. (http://smile.gif)
I can tell because of how pro-american you are.
-
im not sure that 750 ml is considered a fifth here
i believe a fifth is a fifth of a US gallon
the bottle looks about the same size as a 750ml bottle
usually there are half-pints, pints, fifths, liters, half gallons, and gallons
i wish we could switch to the metric system in the US
-
I agree that some of the ideas in the articles are misgiuded. Taking the net back from the corporations should be our first priority. M$, RIAA, Doubleclick, you name it. One of the important themes in the articles is preventing a corporation like M$ from securing both the content and the means of trafficking the content. I don't think this is sufficient, especially given the level of power and disregard for US laws that M$ has. Not to mention the complacency that M$ has engineered in the computer using body (people accepting crappy software as just another fact of life).
Shutting off the EU into a form of the TCPA would be a mistake; one of the greatest things about the net is its ability to unify a group of people across the world. The flow of information would be stiffled.
The constitution doesn't have anything over the TCPA; can you seriously believe that the US founding fathers ever dreamed of such things as time-shifting entertainment? If they wanted to hear a song, they would have to find a preformer. People are trying to use the 1st ammendment to defend a great many things that it is really unsuited for. It is time for a few new additions to our great US constitution. We've done it before. It was designed for it.
As the articles stated, there is a disfunctional view of laws in the US; US citizens expect any new law to come out to strip us further of power and freedom. I think it is well past time to change our thinking. We, as concerned citizens of the governed body, need to take an active part in legislation to ensure that our freedoms are preserved. There is someone who is doing that now: US Rep. Rick Boucher (D-VA). see his page at http://www.house.gov/boucher/welcome.htm (http://www.house.gov/boucher/welcome.htm) . follow the 'Legislative Information' and 'Internet and Technolgy Initiatives' links for information about what he is for. You can also take a look at the following register articles:
http://www.theregus.com/content/archive/25540.html (http://www.theregus.com/content/archive/25540.html)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/23587.html (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/23587.html)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/20839.html (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/20839.html)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/13553.html (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/13553.html)
If everyone expresses thier concern about TCPA, DMCA, CDBTPA, and UCITA, who knows what could happen? we might get a few laws that are actually of the people, for the people, and by the people. who knows?
-t.
-
im no good with politicians
the dirty (clinton) corporations built the internet
now they exploit it
if people are too stupid to notice or don't care, it's simply a (minor) poverty of the human condition. if we want them to care WE have to reach them
US government control alone is not the answer
also...
if the US controls the net many (not all) euros will accuse us of being totalitarian and fight us (read: iraq)
if the US does nothing, we will be accused of being
isolationist and not caring about world issues. (read: kyoto treaty)
damned if ya do, danmed if ya dont
-
clinton corporations started the net? I thought it started in circa 69 with ARPAnet.... despite Al Gore's claim to have invented the whole thing.... As for the WWW; it was started by Tim Berners-Lee, an Englishman, and made availible to the world in 91.
it is the EU that he was considering taking the isolationist stance (either you comply with our version of tcpa, or you won't do anything with any of our servers).
reaching the masses (which will require education) will take time. great things start with the acts of a single man. How would recent US history look if Dr. Martin Luther King waited for his first 100,000 followers before speaking out about racial injustice?
Politicians are corrupt, granted, but shouldn't we try to take a hand in writing laws before someone else (read RIAA, Microsoft, et al) writes them to trample our rights?
-t.
[ August 28, 2002: Message edited by: beltorak0 ]
-
they did not start it, but one cannot deny that over the past 8 years the internet really bacame the massive network, with everything anyone could possibly want.
without the dirty fuckers' money, we would not have this
the problem is that they are dirty... the net is fine
.
.
as for legislation, i am not the man for that particular job... i have a way of torching bridges and making myself look like an ass. a lot of people dont like my opinions, and i dont suffer idiots well. i would gladly contribute, and i can be a leader, but i would really just piss them all off
-
i don't understand why describing how to make a gun bullets and how to shoot it is legal. but giving someone the sourcecode to a program that gives you a root shell thruough SSH isn't.
-
It's because the lawyers are still writing laws for stuff invented 50 years ago (I guessed on that one). They need to catch up ASAP, or shit like that will be legal forever.
-
what it boils down to is that information can be copied and distributed freely with virtually no production cost. You can tell a hundred people how to hack a ssh, and the can tell a hundrend more, then 10,000 people can hack a ssh. Print out a detailed manual on how a gun works, and how to kill with one, and each person has to buy a gun, and at least one bullet....
The entertainment dictators have hated every method of time / space shifting content since the 8 track came out. When it was discovered that analogue copies degrade after a time, they backed off. cd's cost around $.12 - $1.50 to make, yet they cost more than records did when LP's were the hottest thing. why? and why has the price never come down?
And then cd-r's came out.... now they bitch because digital copies never degrade (beyond media damage). So they start the evil things like DMCA, CDBTPA, and TCPA. Everyone thinks that TCPA will be the vehical for pushing DRM down our throats, but it's the other way around I assure you. DRM will be the reason for foisting the TCPA upon us, and then controlling every asprect of our computers. DRM is not the end, but mearly the means.
< /rant>
-t.
-
yeah, sure sucks to be the napster guys
and will soon suck to be affiliated with gnutella (morpheus, etc.)
the big picture: GREED ...dammit
greed, nothing but, and plenty of it. these shitfucks care not about the things they claim to protect... musicians, creativity, intellectual property... they care about FUCKING MONEY and it is blood on the hands of totalitarian - syphallis - hosting - cumguzzling - peter - puffing - genocidal - money - grubbing - facist - poindexter - pencil - pushing - sacks - of - monkey - dung like the ones we are forced to deal with on this beautiful forum.
BAH
and just let me add... don't even begin to think that gnu/gpl is safe. if you believe the TCPA rhetoric about @opting-out@ then you are sadly misinformed
good post beltorak0
-
Hmmm...
Has anyone here ever read a book called "Signal To Noise", by Eric S Nylund?
(OK, I'll understand it id you haven't, so I'll outline the general idea here)
After a series of catastrophic earthquakes, which destroy all of the major fiberoptic "pipes", etc., the American government decides to deal with the whole Net question by rebuilding all the pipes with monitors and filters on all of them, to filter out any non-American content, and to repress people's desires to go overseas, without business reasons. Any who try to go overseas, and are really serious about it, just get detained and have their minds f**ked with.
Is it just me, or is good ol' Mr. Thompson looking for a system just like this? Individual countries will have exculsive control over what comes in and out of their country. Can you even imagine what some European countries would do with that sort of control? For that matter, any country at all?
Remember no *country* is bad. Only people are bad, and even that is a perspective-based thing. America are no more repressive and facist than any European democracy. Maybe that should be thought about a little more.
Service With A Smile (http://smile.gif) ,
Aegwyn
-
since the riaa and such have started fucking my rights over, with shit like the dmca, well, they steal from me, so i steal from them so it all works out...
besides i would rather go to a live show anyway, way more fun then sitting in my room.
-
Screw sony records. I went to but a Cd yesterday and saw:
"Will not play on PC/MAC"
My PC is the centre of my sound system so I guess I have no alternative than to download the whole album (http://smile.gif)
Their loss, not mine...
Problem is I wanted the actual CD. :(
-
If everyone like you would send them a nasty email then maybe they will start getting the hint.
-
dude, my computer has a better sound system then my stereo, infact, my computer goes from soundcard, to amp, to 2 8ohm 200watt speakers, a pair of 6 ohm 200watt speakers, and a pair of 15watt 6 ohm speakers, it is very loud, and has some pretty good sound quality, and im rebuilding the 8 ohm speakers as soon as the guy sells me the woofer's that i want