Stop Microsoft
Miscellaneous => Applications => Topic started by: oceanetz on 2 August 2002, 21:55
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Thank
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Sure, Microsoft has it. Well they used to have it, now they have Visual.net. You still might be able to find it in stores or software mail order. But I suggest you get GCC from http://www.gnu.org/ (http://www.gnu.org/)
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I have it. I bought it for 5 dollars from my college.
They have special pricing if you are a student. All MS Operating systems and programs go for 5 dollars.
No wonder I changed school. Everthing they taught in that college was revolving around MS. And i do mean everything.
There is NOT EVEN ONE class about Unix. NOT EVEN ONE!!!
Maybe its a way to kiss MS ass so they can get cheap offers from them? Who knows.
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We're not a warez site .... now piss off
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Why would you want it?
Now stop playing with yourself, you'll learn about that when you hit puberty.
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Does anyone has Microsoft Visual C++ ?
who cares? quote:
Thank
Don't ment.
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goddamn, someone needs to bundle emacs + gcc3 + gdb and call it visual linux c++ or something like that
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what's next? add a bunch of services, a "TravelTicket" that remembers all personal info on your local machine, official web based linux-anti-spam-mail, html developer studio (enforcing standards compliance), etc etc etc, and call it ".ORG"?
;)
-t.
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Hrm..
*Grumbles a bit and walks away.*
Stupid kids...
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I have the same problem bazokas had. They force you to take a Visual Basic (could it get any worse?!) course before you can take any other programming course, except if you get "Departmental Approval" Well, guess what? There is no such thing...you have to take the course no matter how much you know about any other programming languages. It sucks real bad.
And to answer the original question, no I don't own Visual C++. I use Borland. At least they got that much right!
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quote:
I have the same problem bazokas had. They force you to take a Visual Basic (could it get any worse?!) course before you can take any other programming course, except if you get "Departmental Approval" Well, guess what? There is no such thing...you have to take the course no matter how much you know about any other programming languages. It sucks real bad.
So what's the problem? Go ahead and take the dumbass course. If you have experience with other programming languages, then it ought to be an easy A. One less course to study for, more time to party :D
______________________________________
Live Free or Die: Linux
(http://www.otakupc.com/etsig/dolphin.gif)
There: now you'll never have to look at those dirty Windows anymore
--Daffy Duck :D
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I have to take a visual basic class aswell. It seems to me microsoft bribes schools into teaching visual basic over real programming languages :mad:
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quote:
Originally posted by jtpenrod:
So what's the problem? Go ahead and take the dumbass course. If you have experience with other programming languages, then it ought to be an easy A. One less course to study for, more time to party :D
That's pretty much what it turned into. And yes, I got an A. I think my final grade was a 95.
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my skool teaches Vb to it really sucked. They use visual studio pro and it is really cheap. i got bored one day and upgraded them all to enterprise onday when my teacher was not there and when she got back she was all confused. The skool is changing to JAVA next year but i am think we will be doing Microsofs JAVA andi will be be pissed.
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well, in my programing classes next year, im gonna have to learn my shit, cuase i only can write hello worlds/*that ask question and score you*/ and i need to learn howto use things like qt, sdl, and gtk. and whenever i see windows only code im gonna bitch and show them the right way if i know how. im probably going to fail the course, but then agian, i find time to party :D
[ August 04, 2002: Message edited by: choasforages ]
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In two years i will probably be goin ' to a school where you can learn to become an admin.
Methinks i'll go buy me one of those fuckmicrosoft.com tshirts for when i go to that school ... :D
If they will try to shove any m$ crap through my throat i will just laugh at them and download something open source ....
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Originally posted by VoidMain:
But I suggest you get GCC from
I don't want to bitch about GCC or anything, it's damned decent at what it does. But it is NO replacement for Visual C++. Emacs + GCC isn't either (it's more usefull though, writing C with echo isn't nice).
What is misses is a GUI and window-designer. Now, if you need that is another question - if you don't, GCC is just fine - but those are main parts of Visual C++.
QT Designer and Kdevelop are 2 replacements for this, by the way. There are probably more.
My school (well, univerity) will use Unix (Solaris) next year (http://tongue.gif) . Well, the Beta part will (Alpha and Gamma parts won't, they have Win, but I study physics). I had to use Win @ school for the last 3 years (DOS before that (http://tongue.gif) ).
Then again, I won't actually learn about computers there (well, I probably will - but that's not what I'm supposed to do there).
Mr. Metasyntactic variable: if they teach MS @ school, you can't just 'shove [it] through [your] throat and download something open source'. Not if you want to get the degree that is.
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Microsoft's new programming language is called: "Microsoft Visual C# .NET" and before that they released the new SDK for "Microsoft ADO .NET".
I have the same problem you guys have. I signed up for an ICT school (ROC MBO, for who's really interested) and I have to learn Microsoft Visual Basic there.
I'm betting that I have to learn Visual C# .NET in a few years... hell, what survival change do I have in the IT world when I can only programme in Visual C# .NET and Visual Basic?
None... man, I'm going to learn real programming languages which does me good, like C++, JAVA, Perl, PHP etc so I don't have complaining custumors who say that my "automated" scripts crash everytime they try to do anything.
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In 2004 all New York State high schools will change AP Computer science to Javascript classes, instead of the current C++ classes. Someone, somewhere in NY hates M$...
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I don't want to bitch about GCC or anything, it's damned decent at what it does. But it is NO replacement for Visual C++. Emacs + GCC isn't either (it's more usefull though, writing C with echo isn't nice).
What is misses is a GUI and window-designer. Now, if you need that is another question - if you don't, GCC is just fine - but those are main parts of Visual C++.
QT Designer and Kdevelop are 2 replacements for this, by the way. There are probably more.
There are a couple of good window designers out there. Qt for KDE and Glade for GNOME. Up till now, Qt was somewhat brain dead as a designer in that all you could do with it was create dialogs, wizards, tabbed dialogs, but not main windows with menus, tool bars, and status bars - these had to be hand coded. The latest version of Qt has corrected this flaw. Glade has always been pretty slick for those writing GNOME apps. However, what you won't find is something that is tightly integrated, such as Visual C++. The UNIX programming aids sacrifice the convenience of this tight integration in favor of cross-platform perfromance. Many of the UNIX programming aids and tool kits, such as Qt, FOX, or wxWindows, can be used to write apps for M$ Windows. Try writing a Linux app with Visual C++ and see how far you get (http://tongue.gif)
Furthermore, if you're serious about learning programming, the best place to learn is on a UNIX system. The tightly integrated development aids that come with Winders are more "convenient", but you won't learn very much from using them. These dumbed down development environments lead to dumbed down developers. After all, how else to explain how some M$ apps have up to 2000% more code in them than they really need? (See the Feature Article (http://www.fuckmicrosoft.com/content/whatsbad.shtml) for details)
________________________________________
Live Free or Die: Linux
(http://www.otakupc.com/etsig/dolphin.gif)
There: now you'll never have to look at those dirty Windows anymore
--Daffy Duck :D
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jt, well said. Don't really need to say much more other than VC++ sucks and GCC is the only way...
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Originally posted by Refalm:
Microsoft's new programming language is called: "Microsoft Visual C# .NET" and before that they released the new SDK for "Microsoft ADO .NET".
I have the same problem you guys have. I signed up for an ICT school (ROC MBO, for who's really interested) and I have to learn Microsoft Visual Basic there.
I'm betting that I have to learn Visual C# .NET in a few years... hell, what survival change do I have in the IT world when I can only programme in Visual C# .NET and Visual Basic?
None... man, I'm going to learn real programming languages which does me good, like C++, JAVA, Perl, PHP etc so I don't have complaining custumors who say that my "automated" scripts crash everytime they try to do anything.
sorry man but ROC MBO informatica is pathetic, we have one interm (stagiere) here from there and he had to unlearn practically everything he had learned. They should call it the M$ farm btw .....
skip MBO, get your HAVO diploma and go to a HBO.....
[ August 05, 2002: Message edited by: BadKarma ]
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Originally posted by jtpenrod:
However, what you won't find is something that is tightly integrated, such as Visual C++.
Borland (http://www.borland.com) will release Kylix 3.0 open edition for linux soon, with C++ support. Not that I'm a big fan of borland products, but this seemed pretty interesting to me. Going to check it out when they actually release it ;)
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I'm in first year uni doing IT / microelectronic engineering, and at the moment we're doing Java. I did VB at hight school for about a week (and i only went to 1 class (http://smile.gif) ) but we also did heaps on microsoft access, which is how I got my job. All you anti-microsoft people would love this job - the company makes database management software, basic design is done in access 2000, then it's converted to VB6, and then eventually it's going to go to .net (I can't believe that thing takes up 4 DVD's)
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Originally posted by beltorak0:
what's next? add a bunch of services, a "TravelTicket" that remembers all personal info on your local machine, official web based linux-anti-spam-mail, html developer studio (enforcing standards compliance), etc etc etc, and call it ".ORG"?
;)
-t.
Have you not heard of .GNU??? I just did browsing on www.gnu.org (http://www.gnu.org)
http://dotgnu.info/ (http://dotgnu.info/)
Thats Linux .GNU
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yup portablie .net, i really like the mono .net project, the opensource community is going to beat microsoft at creating .net i belive, just look at qt# and gtk#, for somereason, i think that microsoft is a bit behind on that one. and the qt, and gtk comunitys will just have anohter languger to go at each other with.
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BadKarma: skip MBO, get your HAVO diploma and go to a HBO.....
No I couldn't... I had trouble finnishing MAVO already, and HAVO seems too difficult anyways...
Do you have some advise of how I can do better than my ROC teachers? (the failures of your stagaire can be very helpfull to me)
[ August 12, 2002: Message edited by: Refalm ]
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Visual Studio .NET is a dream and well worth the money. Glade is a punk program for GNOME fantastics and Kdevelop is slow (dammit QT period is slow)
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Windows XP User #5225982375: Visual Studio .NET is a dream and well worth the money.
The only in Visual Studio .NET programmes I've seen are meanth for cracking, flooding, making trojans...
Nice programmes to play with, none of them are really serious.
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No I couldn't... I had trouble finnishing MAVO already, and HAVO seems too difficult anyways...
:-/
HAVO was a no brainer for me. I flunked once in second grade (can't remember why, dont want to either). But I did absolutely nothing for 6 years but showing up. Homework? What's that? And even the showing up part faded away. My absence in my graduation year totals up to at least 1/5th of the year (I wasn't at school at least once a week) but they couldn't expell me or anything because my grades didn't suffer (http://smile.gif)
The look on all the teachers faeces errr faces when I walked away with my diploma was worth a million bucks ...
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Do you have some advise of how I can do better than my ROC teachers? (the failures of your stagaire can be very helpfull to me)
From what I observed it's nigh on impossible to fail (unless you are a complete retard). Our (stagiare) learned more in 2.5 months with us then in 2 years of school.
I can only judge according to what others have told me though, I've never been there myself. I saw some course material from our (stagiare) and I basically laughed my ass off at how easy it was.
I guess it all depends on what you want though... if you aspire a programming job, don't go there, period. If you want to administer windowze boxes then go there. If you want to have a basic diploma and learn stuff on your own time then go there.
I don't want to tell you not to go to school but if you ask my opinion it's highly overrated. You can learn a lot more practical stuff a lot faster by doing it instead of theorizing about it (this more reflects me on a HBO informatica though, there is not much theorizing done on a MBO informatica ;) ).
phew ... long post, I'm all done now (http://smile.gif)
NOTE:
I thought the correct english word for stagiare was interm, but according to kdict interm is no english word and I seem to have misplaced my dictionary (http://smile.gif)
[ August 12, 2002: Message edited by: BadKarma ]
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Originally posted by Windows XP User #5225982375:
Visual Studio .NET is a dream and well worth the money. Glade is a punk program for GNOME fantastics and Kdevelop is slow (dammit QT period is slow)
Now I have been working with Qt for a bit longer as a year and I can assure you that it is not slow. The slowness you are probably referring to is due to the object prelinking issue currently troubling KDE (watch out, semi large techinal word there).
as usual you're just mistaking your ass for your mouth and produce nothing but shit .....
and btw xp luser ... don't take my sig message to seriously man ;)
[ August 12, 2002: Message edited by: BadKarma ]
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BadKarma: From what I observed it's nigh on impossible to fail (unless you are a complete retard).
Most students on the ROC are retards... I noticed 2 out of 50 that where good in computers.
Some guy couldn't find the minimize button after 3 years of studiying.
Another student had to copy a tekst from a website. The website had a right-click prevention. The guy kept on clicking the right mouse button while thinking why it wouldn't work.
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BadKarma: Our (stagiare) learned more in 2.5 months with us then in 2 years of school.
Some guy on my old school said that he wasn't going to the ROC, but that he was going to study by himself. I guess he was right all along.
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BadKarma:I saw some course material from our (stagiare) and I basically laughed my ass off at how easy it was.
I asked a teacher of the ROC if there wasn't enough Windows already on their school, and if we would be able to study something not Microsoft related. He said that 90% of the whole world use Windows. What a monkeyfucking Steve Ballmer asskisser. I guess they don't want to lose big funder uncle Gates.
[ August 12, 2002: Message edited by: Refalm ]
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Originally posted by BadKarma:
and btw xp luser ... don't take my sig message to seriously man ;)
:D
Karma, i think you're right about the practical part of learning programming and stuff:
When i first started with linux, i started off with slackware. I learned more in two weeks than i could've done in two years with something else.
It was a bitch to get running with 0% experience, but i did get it and never want to go back to windows again !
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Originally posted by TheQuirk:
I have to take a visual basic class aswell. It seems to me microsoft bribes schools into teaching visual basic over real programming languages :mad:
VB is a real programming language... Its just an easy one... Jesus fucking christ I wish u MAC LOVERS would stop dissing Microsoft products!
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Originally posted by LoL:
VB is a real programming language..
thats a good one... i havent laughed like that since WinXP Luser posted something stupid.
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Originally posted by LoL:
VB is a real programming language... Its just an easy one... Jesus fucking christ I wish u MAC LOVERS would stop dissing Microsoft products!
it isxp loser. 90% chance. either that or xp loser has started a school for fucktards and this is the first graduate...
[ September 14, 2002: Message edited by: Calum ]